Silver Efex Pro U Points Sliders Gone!

[constie]

First off, we need to establish the size of the screen one is working on if we are taking about say a 16in Mac then potentially there is a crowding issue. But if we are taking about a screen 27in or larger for that matter then less so. My raw files come out of D850 there is no point working on them on tiny screen. Similarly some people use all the adjustments and some do not. Neither of those scenarios inevitably leads to the eradication of the U point uniqueness. It is entirely possible to retain it and supercharge it not kill it off with feeble excuses of progress. In fact I would suggest that many including myself would be happy to pay extra for the ability to customise the selection of the adjustors on the U point and that could be a revenue generator on a Basic vs Pro version for example. Customisation is a trend which runs across many creative sectors and is the way by which brands can deliver exceptional user experience. If the technology great but the delivery is simply, one fits all, then those who don’t fit move on. Time will tell but having been a user of NIK products from the first year it appeared, I am now looking sideways for effective tools. Something which I would never have done If at the very least I was given the option at the installation stage to keep the old version. Attempting to migrate your loyal base without explicit advanced information erodes trust. DXO has my email …and a fair bit of my cash they could have told me SPECIFICALLY what the new upgrades meant. Removing the sliders when they where the point of uniqueness is not exactly a minor change…

[mwsilvers (Mark - New Jersey, USA)]

@constie

If U points, are not in ones taste, then there are plenty of good products out there to use and be creative with. What I don’t understand why eradicate such a useful and intuitive and dear I say unique tool.

They did not eradicate the U-Points. The end result of using them is the same as before. All they changed was the location of the adjustment sliders.

Mark

[constie]

Mark they did all that is left is a tool to control the area of influence. Everyone one else has sliders on the side panel it’s not exactly a new concept. Even phone apps got them. Sliders positioned where the eye is looking at is like the controls of jet project a fighter pilot’s visor it requires no extra effort to absorb the information. It is about ergonomics not technology and if there is such a wide antipathy to them why did so many people used them when there is so much other choice out there.

[colin_g]

Just as a matter of perspective - I hate the U Point controls contaminating my view of the image. Always have and always will. Change, fortunately, has come and it is not going away. I for one am extremely grateful.

[Joanna (Joanna Carter)]

@constie

Sliders positioned where the eye is looking at is like the controls of jet project a fighter pilot’s visor it requires no extra effort to absorb the information

The problem being, as others have pointed out, they can get in the way, especially with adjustments to small areas of the image

[constie]

That’s throwing the baby out with the bath water. If that is the MAJOR IN HAND issue then the solution should in the preferences to allow a user to select ghosting any of the sliders not used whilst making the adjustment or even increasing / decreasing the visibility.

[constie]

Why use NIK products if you hate it’s unique point of difference??? Strange comment

[mwsilvers (Mark - New Jersey, USA)]

@constie

Why use NIK products if you hate it’s unique point of difference??? Strange comment

People seem to like using the Nik Collection in spite of this “unique point of difference”, not because of it. I know I do, and apparently @colin_g and others do as well. You seem focused more on the process than on the results. For many of us the older process was poor even though we loved the results we got from it. Now we can get those same results without having to deal with this “unique point of difference”,

Mark

[colin_g]

@constie

Why use NIK products if you hate it’s unique point of difference??? Strange comment

Not strange at all! It is rather like driving a car with great performance but uncomfortable seats.

[constie]

I have no interest in the process at all I try to get the picture I want in camera with as little post as possible and that is why the localised control point are so great dodge burn tweak and move on . I dislike post with a vengeance and yes it is about the results

[uncoy (Alec Kinnear)]

@mwsilvers

Unfortunately, over time technology changes. While you may strongly and passionately believe that this new design is a terrible idea and the older U-Point approach should be restored, I suspect that the majority of current users will applaud the change. I also suspect that new users of the Nik Collection will also prefer this cleaner and easier to use design.

Mark, I’ve heard you say exactly the same words to any change, positive or negative in Photolab or other DxO software. The argument would be more credible if your reaction varied more. It’s almost as if you are entirely uncritical towards DxO and anything DxO does is for the better, thanks to their infinite wisdom. Perhaps this impression is just an accident: you carefully say nothing when a change is made which you actively dislike.

There’s no real reason to move away from on image controls. In terms of interrupting visual flow, making the sliders disappear after five or eight seconds of static mouse would be enough to allow photographers to see their changes without the sliders on top. On a very big monitor, having the controls off at the side is not particularly comfortable. Putting local controls right on top of the area which they are supposed to adjust was a huge innovation – the U-point technology. This new hybrid layer technology is not necessarily a step forward. I’m sticking with Nik 3 for awhile due to compatibility and performance issues so I’ll only find out later.

[mwsilvers (Mark - New Jersey, USA)]

Alec, my opinion on the change to the Nik Collection’s U-Point functionality has nothing to do with my support for DXO or PhotoLab. When I started using the Nik Collection in 2016, DXO Labs hadn’t acquired it yet. I didn’t even know DXO Labs existed and was unfamiliar with OpticsPro. Having said that, I disliked Nik’s U-Point paradigm from the start even though I loved the results I got from it.

I use a 28-in 4K monitor and I have no difficulty or discomfort using the controls In the right hand panel. All of the global controls were there already. Now the interface has a consistent look and feel. I much prefer it and look forward to DXO doing the same thing in Photolab.

As to my support for DXO, you are correct. I do strongly support their efforts which is why I decided to become a beta tester. And yes, starting in 2018 I was more willing to forgive issues with their software because they were going through a bankruptcy reorganization and I supported their efforts to help ensure they would stay in business. In some of my posts I actually indicated that as my reason for a lack of criticism for what I considered minor issues. However, If you take a look at a number of my posts on Photolab 2 you will see that I was highly critical of DXO because that release had virtually no significant enhancements in it.

There are also many other issues today that I am critical of like some of their pricing models and upgrade rules which negatively impact those who buy a product several weeks before the next version is released. Another is the lack of support for older Mac operating systems. Apple releases new operating systems so frequently it is incumbent upon software companies to offer support for more than a couple of versions if technically feasible. However, I am not a Mac user, and lack the technical competence to add my comments to those threads discussing this topic.

I like to think that my comments are even handed. I always try to look at both sides of an issue and find some middle ground that people can agree on. However if I feel strongly about something I express my opinions without reservation but try to keep hyperbole and emotion out of it.

Mark

[constie]

Well said. What I don’t get, why people think that new technology and usability are not part of the same solution. The on screen vs side panel is a non argument both are just ‘ knobs’ to be used as needed and the suggestion of fading them after a certain time could be set in the preferences… any tech innovation at the engine end is fine and dandy … I was wondering if you could advise how I could get the previous version downloaded and reinstalled?

[Wolfgang ([ Win10, PL+VP+FP, Nik6 (+3) ])]

@constie,
did you ask DxO support for a download link for the previous version ( Nik 3.3 )?

• being on Windows, I installed the old version ‘over’ the new one
  → Issues with Nik4 - #8 by Wolfgang

• some ‘comparison’ with PL’s side menue
  → About Nik 4 - SilverEfex 3 & Viveza 3

• unfortunately SEP3 & Viv3 are incompatible with older PS versions
  → Backward Incompatibility Viveza - #2 by Wolfgang

[constie]

Thank you I’ll try that

[Prem (Win11, Sony a99, PL, FP, VP.)]

Well, I have to agree with constie. The u points are so intuitive to learn and obviously to constie… For some of the operations, the sidebar sliders are useful and convenient. Not for burning in small areas. First of all you have to take your eye off of the point to find the slider you require, then bring your eye back to the point and hope that you haven’t let go of the slider and moved the mouse or your pointer and ended up on a different slider and adjusted the wrong thing.

What would be ideal is to be able to double-click the U point to hide its sliders and double-click again to bring them back when needed. And probably the same for the u points in PhotoLab 4 then we can all have the best of both worlds.

Prem

[ButchR (Marvin Reinhart)]

I think that those who have an idea on how the U points could be improved from the sliders being on the side should create “Which feature do you need?” posting and people could vote on it and DxO could consider it. I believe that would do more to get a response and perhaps a change from DxO than the individual comments in the feedback forum. I know I am more apt to vote on a topic than get into a back and forth that goes no where.

Peace

[constie]

Hi, I don’t often get into these sort of discussions but over the years I have relied heavily in the Nik Software and in particular the u’points for sustainable productivity, so I am new to this. Your suggestion is very good so I will attempt to set something up thank you

[Ianwm]

I have read all the posts and am disappointed to see it turn into an “either or” solution rather than a “both and” solution.
I agree with adding back a collapsible slider set to the control point but also at other times like the side controls, especially with groups.
So if a poll is set up please include the option for both sets of controls to be available.
Thank you!

[c.gephart]

After working with the new format for a couple weeks I, personally, miss the controls at the u-point. Working at the side bar means I must now look back and forth between the point and the sidebar. I realize, different strokes for different folks and that the change was supposedly necessary to make the software more flexible going forward. I’ve been using computers since 83, and supporting them professionally since 95, so I know change is inevitable and that we eventually adapt or find something that suits better. Sadly, this change has made editing less enjoyable for me.