@mwsilvers
… but isn’t the reason people buy the Pro or Elite versions of software that they shall get access to all the essential tools? The confusion manifest itself when they find out that wasn’t what they got. Looking for the Fine Contrast? … the game is on, hide and seek! Clue - you won’t find it where you expect it to be!
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@mwsilvers That doesn’t address my point about professional or customer reviews of DXO Photolab. They review the product that they receive. They then compare a “crippled” program with “normal” full featured software and make their recommendation/purchase choice based on what they see.
To take up your excellent point, perhaps it’s time DXO marketed Photolab “Ultimate” which is the combination of PL/FP/VP in-built functionality but without the separate plugin programs. As you say they do offer the bundle, if you look for it. This approach wouldn’t directly rule out people wanting to purchase the plugins for use in PS/LR/AP etc?
Reviews of Photoshop “Ultimate” would be far more compelling/competitive against the competition compared to Photolab Elite. Just the Fine Contrast and tonal contrast sliders alone would be a huge improvement.
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What is an essential tool and what is not comes down to a matter of opinion. Far some people the Basic version of PhotoLab has all the essential tools they need. For others it is PhotoLab Elite that better meets their needs., And for still others. like me, The entire suite is essential.
There are those who have posted here who believe that creative vignetting is an essential tool and should be part of PhotoLab Elite. Others say the same thing about the channel mixer. Still others expect PhotoLab Elite to contain the creative blurring tool, or the filter tool, or the frame tool. I think the perspective tool in Viewpoint is absolutely essential but many people don’t seem to need it. If you want a full featured version of PhotoLab, it must include PhotoLab Elite, Viewpoint, and FilmPack Elite. Anything less is a compromise.
The whole PhotoLab suite is expensive, but DxO to its credit has created a modular system to give users a pricing choice. It is easy to second guess their decision regarding which features to place where, but I can say that in the four and one half years I have been using their products, until now the lack of the Fine contrast sliders in PhotoLab Elite has not seemed to be a particularly serious issue for anyone. Perhaps DxO should more clearly indicate the differences between the full suite and the individual parts in their marketing information.
Mark
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the only reason i ended buying Topaz DeNoise AI was because it operated on TIFF files while DP does not. (it works great on scanned negatives from the late '70s and early '80s). I would have preferred to do everything within PL5
Yep. I also own a license for Topaz Denoise for those few occasions when I need to reduce noise in a Tiff or jpeg file.
Mark
Joanna, are the contrast sliders in FP different to those in PL?
Sliders in PL:
No. Here they are…
If you don’t see all of them, it means you need to click on the little + symbol…
Looks like we got screenshots from PL in both posts…
I’ve removed the FP app quite a while ago and can’t therfore provide a screenshot…
Yes I have those sliders in both PL and FP. I was wondering if they are different in each app somehow, or are they only in PL because I also have FP?
I’m not quite sure what you are asking. If you are wondering if you have full use of all features of Filmpack 6 Elite from within Photolab 5; the answer is yes provided that you have a license for FP6E. It is integrated within PL5 and you don’t even need to install the standalone version, just activate FP6E from within PL5 and you’ll have complete access.
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Yes, Fine Contrast would not be there in PL if you hadn´t installed FP too. If you have both you might see this as an academic question but if you havn´t it might confuse you a bit because it´s not very logical to separate one out of three “contrast functions” as DXO has done. Has anyone seen anything like it in any other converter or grphical software? I haven´t!
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maybe, but these sliders are worth (the greater part of) the FP license cost imo. Being able to adjust fine contrast in separate tonal ranges is a big plus for me.
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VP and FP are part of the PhotoLab Suite. If someone wants all the features PhotoLab has to offer then they purchase the the whole suite. If they don’t want to spend the cash to buy the whole suite then they have to expect compromises on features. I am not sure why we are still arguing about this, It seems that some folks want the features but are not willing to pay for them.
I have long advocated that giving customers this choice just agitates them. .I think they should just market the entire Elite suite as a single package without the standalone versions of VP and FP. For those that want them they can sell the standalones for a bit less money without the PhotoLab functionality. PhotoLab with the internal versions of VP and FP included could also sell for somewhat less than the current cost of the suite. However, it would still cost much more than the current cost of PhotoLab Elite alone, but at least it would eliminate all the confusion over features and hopefully stop the complaints.
Mark
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Thank you. That’s exactly what I wanted to know. It is a peculiar decision.
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The cynic in me would say it was a marketing “ploy” but then you know that I am not a cynic!?
I already have a number of products that I can feed an exported JPG through to add ‘Fine Contrast’ or ‘Clarity’ and for the £129 being asked for FilmPack I could get an up to data copy of ON1 for £82.69, InPixio Photo Editor for £20, Paintshop Pro for £34.99 (all upgrade versions because I have bought older versions in the past).
But it is better to be able to use the feature while “developing” a RAW image
@platypus Yes but at a considerable cost as I explained above when I firmly believed that they should be part of the DxPL (indeed DxOP) product from the start! I don’t want or need all the other clever features that FP offers just ‘Fine Contrast’.
In truth I would be content with just ‘Fine Contrast’ alone
@mwsilvers I am sorry if you are bored with the topic and would like us to stop “whinging” about it and just buy FP or forego access to the feature.
I am glad that you can afford it and hope that you make good use of all the features FP has to offer but could it not be that others are right when suggesting that this feature belongs in both DxPL and FP, the former because it belongs there and the latter because it might be useful to others using FP as an add-on for other software.
Currently I have access to FP as my “reward” for taking part in PL5 Beta testing, I had already purchased DxPL before the reward scheme was announced (in truth I didn’t actually realise there was any “reward” on offer) but any changes that DxO make to DxPL and FP in the future may well render that version obsolete/incompatible.
Buying an expensive add-on for a single feature, useful though it might be, is not my idea of value-for-money. The camera market may be coming out with cameras costing £4,000 plus and the software market may be pushing their prices ever upwards but for those of us on limited disposable incomes and for whom photography is a hobby, not a source of income, every penny counts.
Agreed, “peculiar” and expensive!
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I stand by my original arguments. If you want everything that PhotoLab has to offer then you need to purchase the suite. Yes the prices are expensive, but they are consistent with Capture 1. For those who feel that the price to get all the features they want is too high, there’s always the option to use ON 1.
With regard to being able to afford to purchase this suite, I do wonder how much the people who are concerned about the price of the whole suite have invested in their cameras, lenses, tripods, speed lights, and other accessories. I believe that for most of them the cost of the DxO suite may be a very small fraction of their overall investment.
Mark
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@mwsilvers I understand your comments about the cost of the software versus the cost of my equipment but that doesn’t change the v.f.m. of having to purchase FP for essentially one feature!
I currently almost exclusively use a second-hand Panasonic G9 with an Olympus 12-200 (24-400) lens, value about £1,200. I frequently use a monopod as a stick, which cost £7.95, the camera and lens fit in a case that cost £9.00, uses batteries that cost £22 for 2 and a filter that cost £15. The SD cards are a slightly different story with 1667x and an older 1000x Lexar 128GB (actually a replacement from Lexar when the original failed) both fitted to the G9.
I do possess other cameras and lenses, all bought when on special offer but the G9 and the Olympus lens are the camera and lens combination I use “daily”.
So for a full inventory we have
Olympus EM1 MKii with 12-200(24-400) lens £1,050
Second hand Panasonic DMC-G9 £600
Panasonic DMC-GX80, with lens £279.99
Panasonic FZ330 £280
All except one lens came with previous purchases that were (part) traded in for the current cameras
Lumix 12-60, Lumix 14-140, Lumix 12-35 pancake (included in cost of GX80)
Olympus 17mm f1.2 (free as part of an offer and currently in use by my youngest son!)
Olympus 17mm f1.8 given to me as a Christmas present some years ago by my youngest son.
Olympus 12-50 £115 (with “pseudo” macro) second-hand
No lights and a tripod that cost £60 (bought for photographing old photo albums) plus I use a monopod as mentioned above (mostly as a walking stick) and take photos of plants, grandchildren and occasionally scenery, boats and whatever else crosses my path!
Two straight out of the camera and one developed in PL5 (I take JPG + RAW)!
It would be interesting to see them launching those fishing boats and then hauling then back up the beach on their “skids”.
Sorry I went right off topic there, unforgivable.
Plus DxO Elite update yearly, plus Zoner subscription £30 yearly plus the occasional additional photo software purchase if an offer comes along and the original version is getting really old!
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So are you saying that Topaz Denoise is better than Nik Dfine?
No one is forcing you to update yearly, and Viewpoint and FilmPack historically are only updated every 4 or 5 years.
The initial cost of the whole suite might be prohibitive for you and I certainly understand your concerns, but it is what it is and it’s not going to change.
As I indicated earlier, there are other features in both Viewpoint and FilmPack for which there have been complaints over the years because they’re not available in PhotoLab Elite.
While the lack of fine contrast in PhotoLab has become a big issue in this thread, in the last 4 + years that I’ve been around here it’s hardly ever been touched on.
Mark