M1 vs Intel Macs

My new MacBook Pros is a total game changer for me, but perhaps PL5 is not the best example for comparing performance except when using DeepPRIME.When I look at my applications in the system profiler, they are all identified as either Intel, Apple Silicon, or Universal. DxO FilmPack 6.1, PhotoLab 5.1.1, and ViewPoint 3 3.1, are all listed as Intel. In the NIK by Dxo suite, all items are Universal, except Perspective Efex, SilverEfex Pro, and Viveza which are Intel. However, parts of PhotoLab 5 have clearly been recompiled to take advantage of Apple Silicon. On my quad-core 4 GHz i7 iMac, processing a single raw file with DeepPRIME (in addition to many other changes) used to take between 45 seconds and a minute. On my 14" M1 Max MacBook Pro, the same takes between 5 and 7 seconds in batch mode, and best of all, it’s the same whether I’m on battery or plugged in: no more performance penalty for not being near an outlet. So again, if you do a great deal of DeepPRIME, you will save much time in processing images, If not, the change with DxO software is not (yet) as dramatic.

Thank you for the rundown, but perhaps you can explain to me what it means to have an app identified as Intel, Apple Silicon or Universal. Does identification as Apple Silicon mean that it was designed for the M1 chip? Or that it processes differently when there is an MI chip (perhaps those both are the same thing). Or something else? And if Apple Silicon is different from Intel, then what is Universal?

And what apps might be identified as Apple Silicon other than some of those Nik apps (which I rarely use)?

Mike, from what I understand, Intel means that an application was written for Macs with Intel CPUs (though portions of it may have been recompiled for Apple CPUs), Apple Silicon means that the application was recompiled to run natively on Apple CPUs, and Universal means that the application will run natively on machines with either Intel or Apple CPUs. Apps written for Intel Macs run on the new Apple hardware in emulation using Rosetta2. It’s very similar too what happened when Apple migrated from PowerPC processor to Intel processors some 15 years ago. It’s amazing that even in emulation (which always slows things down), many apps written for Intel chips are actually running faster on Apple CPUs.

Thank you.

I can see how all of the apps would run on the M1 machines since the Intel stuff would be running under emulation, but that makes me wonder what they do with the Apple Silicon apps that end up running on Intel machines. Even on Intel machines with older OS versions.

It also makes me wonder if some of the problems I am seeing with Nik 4’s Viveza 3 and Perspective FX on my Intel machine might have something to do with this. Here is a screen shot of Viveza 3 on my MBP running Monterey:

As you can see, there are no controls or buttons or widgets visible.

This began happening when I installed a brightness control app to tone down the screen when I am working in a dark room, and it sometimes still happens even when the app is no longer on my system. Perhaps it is the result of an OS bug in dealing with the Silicon apps on an Intel platform since it only happens with the Silicon Nik 4 apps.

Sorry for slow reply. Demonising with Deep Prime…it is amazing compared to my old stuff!

tom

Sorry, my Mac knows better than I what I mean to type! Should be denoising of course

tom

(It did it again in this note before I caught it as I guess it did with your mail)!

Yes. Exactly.

But I was wondering if the denoising (see, I made sure it was the right word this time) in your timing was HQ, PRIME or DeepPRIME.

The vast majority of Intel apps run under emulation, but not all. Apparently, there are certain exceptions. Pure Apple Silicon apps do not run on Intel machines at all. If you install an application, the installer must either detect what type of machine you are on and install a version for that CPU or install a version that will run on either platform.
On Apple Silicon Macs you do lose certain things; for instance, you cannot run Bootcamp and set up a Windows partition on your Mac, at least not yet. This doesn’t bother me because I don’t need to run Windows, but it’s good to know if you are contemplating going with Apple Silicon.
Regarding NIK, all the parts ran fine on my Intel iMac and are running fine on my Apple Silicon MacBook Pro. The only problem I have is with Perspective Efex which refuses to run as a Photoshop Plugin. According to DxO Tech Support, they are working on this; the appears to be an issue with the latest version of Photoshop (it runs fine when launched directly, i.e., not as a plug-in). Interestingly enough, Perspective Efex is the only part of Nik that installs a separate program called Perspective Efex Launcher. l I have no idea why that is needed, nor do I have an idea why you are having this problem with Viveza. If it ran fine without the brightness control app, I would simply de-install NIK with the deinstaller provided by DxO and reinstall it. It might fix the issue,
Cheers and Happy 2022!

[quote=“dkiechle, post:28, topic:24044, full:true”]
The vast majority of Intel apps run under emulation, but not all. Apparently, there are certain exceptions. Pure Apple Silicon apps do not run on Intel machines at all. If you install an application, the installer must either detect what type of machine you are on and install a version for that CPU or install a version that will run on either platform. [/quote]

OK. That makes perfect sense.

[quote=“dkiechle, post:28, topic:24044, full:true”]
On Apple Silicon Macs you do lose certain things; for instance, you cannot run Bootcamp and set up a Windows partition on your Mac, at least not yet. [/quote]

I had kept a Parallels volume on my system for years in case I wanted to run Windows. When I did a rebuild (ie, did a clean install of Monterey to clean up my system) I realized I had not purposely run Windows on the machine for years, so I just left it off.

As for Bootcamp, I never used it at all.

[quote=“dkiechle, post:28, topic:24044, full:true”]
Perspective Efex is the only part of Nik that installs a separate program called Perspective Efex Launcher. [/quote]

Where did you find this Perspective Efex Launcher app? I have searched my system and not found a trace of it. Then again, perhaps that is an artifact of the Silicon systems in that they need a special launcher app.

[quote=“dkiechle, post:28, topic:24044, full:true”]
If it ran fine without the brightness control app, I would simply de-install NIK with the deinstaller provided by DxO and reinstall it. It might fix the issue, [/quote]

Ah. I have uninstalled and reinstalled the Nik stuff perhaps a half dozen times, with no effect, but that was all before I removed the brightness apps so perhaps this would be a good time to do it agin. Thanks for the suggestion.

And to you as well.

It is here: /Library/Application Support/DxO/Perspective Efex/Perspective Efex Launcher.app

Note that this is not your user library; it’s the main library at the root level of your Mac.

D.

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Right you are!

I had searched all of the user folders that I thought might be used - Applications, the user Library folders and even the documents and downloads folders and found nothing. It had not occurred to me to check the system Library, but there it is.

Interestingly enough there is also a PL5 Launch Agent, although this one is in the User Library at

Application Support/Dxo Labs/LaunchAgents

at least on my machine.

DxO components exist in several places all over you Mac. Depending on the scope of a component, it is located under /Library or ~Library = /Users/accountname/Library. A few things exist in hidden folders too, but these can mostly be left alone.

To toggle visibility of hidden files on and off, press SHIFT-COMMAND-PERIOD.

Yes. I have the hidden folders turned visible on my system.

I thought I answered this. Denoising with deep prime, 20Mp full M4/3 image is averaging 6 seconds.

The really strange thing which I only noticed today, is that denoising with HQ takes 6 seconds, and with prime takes about 20 sec. Deep prime must be optimized to use the DNEs in a way which the other options do not.

Any thoughts, anyone?

tom

DeepPrime uses a GPU, if there is one that will do the job. Having a decent GPU makes Prime irrelevant for RAW files. It’s still useful for non-raw files though.

DNEs? I guess I am not familiar with that acronym.

In any case I read in one of the posts on this forum that the DeepRAW processing leverages the GPU as well as the CPU while HQ and PRIME use only the CPU. If that is true it explains why my DeepPRIME processing time is less than the processing time for HQ or PRIME. For my system processing times were highest for PRIME, less for HQ and much less for DeepPRIME.

I am not sure what the relationship would be for something like my old Mini which did not have a separate graphics card.

You can switch off the use of the GPU in PhotoLab’s preferences. Be prepared for abysmally looooong processing times with DeppPrime.

I’m retired, and it’s cold outside, so I do have some time to spare.

I think I will run some timing tests, just to see what I see.

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Well, that falls under the category of “Things I don’t want to do again”.

CPU Only -
38 minutes, 15 seconds for 27 images, or 85 seconds/image

That is compared to 16.7 second with the GPU, so about 1/5 of the processing time.

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Sorry I was referring to the Mac mini’s neural engines. I has 8 graphics cores and 16 neural engines, but I am not sure how deep prime is distributed amongst them. I am not sure where the 'D"
’ came from!

tom